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i read confusion in the sub text, am anyways sceptical about a woman leader whose husband brought so much shame to her and she still stood by him, life's too interesting coz of her but,


I don't agree with a gemini rising for Hillary. Her first impression is definitely one of a scorpio. I met her in a small Vermont town years ago and privately, not with others around. We had only a short while together, so I could only go on first impressions. They definitely did not conjure up Gemini. Scorpio would be my pick.

p.s. being a mother of a 22 year old, I still remember the birth as if it was yesterday, right down to the time of day I first saw that miracle put onto my chest!


Hi dprimmer - Well, Hilary IS a Scorpio, so that impression would be natural. Having been married to more than one woman with Scorpio rising, to me she doesn't have the physiotype to be a Scorpio rising, but she looks like quite a few Gemini rising people I've known. Glad you can remember your child's birth so vividly. I've known thousands who did, and thousands who didn't. My own mom didn't remember if it was 1:14 am or pm when I was born. Go figure.

Arlene Tognetti

Been reading the good article about Senator Clinton and if she has a Gemini
Asc or Scorpio....I teach Astrology here in Seattle Washington and for the last 4 years we have a group of astrologers that get together and read many charts of celebrities etc etc and we watch the Celebs do their lives in real time..
As the campaigns and primaries have been exposing MORE character and tendencies..
We agree that Senator Clinton's chart probably is Scorpio Rising with the Sun
in the Twelfh House and Moon in the 4th...Yes she is an advocate for children, the elderly and making sure we are fiscally responsible...and she is an INTENSE
woman and human being .....She LOOKS like a Scorpio talks like one and walks
like one as we would say......Now the problem if that be the her 7th HOUSE husband Pres Bill Clinton the ruler of the house of husband is in her 12th house sometimes good sometimes your undoing....we will be watching....

thanks for allowing this forum...

Arlene Tognetti
and Astrologer's Forum
Kent Washington


Only someone who has never given birth could postulate that a mother could ever be less well informed about time of birth than the child. (Even if drugged or in a coma, a mother would have learned and instantly memorized that information post birth). Unreal. But Hillary says she was named for a mountain climber who only achieved the summit of Mt. Everest several years after Hillary Clinton's birth, so it's entirely possible that her own mother -who was there at the time, duh- is just wrong!


Hi Arlene - While there is much speculation about Hillary's rising sign, I do not believe she is a Scorpio rising, due to my experience with hundreds of Scorpio ascendant people. She just doesn't have the physiotype in my experience. Having been married to two Scorpio rising people, with my stepdaughter and godson both Scorpio rising and my wife's daughter Scorpio rising (to name but a few), Hillary physically doesn't look like it. Of course she SHOULD have many Scorpio traits, since that's her Sun sign, and with Gemini rising, her Sun would rule her 3rd house of communication and expressions.

Hi KL - Well, as I stated earlier, I've known hundreds of women who had no idea when their child(ren) were born. I guess my mom memorized the time but couldn't figure out whether it was afternoon or the middle of the night. As for Hillary claiming to be named after Sir Edmund, well, that sounds like an urban legend, and I doubt such an intelligent attorney would make such a claim, given how it could be quickly discredited. Sort of like the many children I knew growing up claiming to be descended from Robert E Lee. If they all were, the general would have been a very busy man after the war!


Has anyone progressed her chart to see if she will win?


I agree on Hillary's Gemini rising. Lots of quick hand movements, sharp features, can come across as chatty and breezy on the surface of all the Scorpio intensity.

I remember my son's birth time because I'm the one who looked at the clock and called it. However, I myself was born by emergency c-section and my mom didn't see me until the next day. My birth time on the certificate was listed as an even 9:30 p.m., and only after years of not feeling or looking like a Gemini rising (and getting that corroborated on an astro-lookalike forum where you posted a picture for people to guess your sign, and I was guessed Pisces or Cancer over and over) I became convinced that my birth time was no earlier than 9:50 p.m with Cancer on the ascendant. Once I realized this, a lot of life events and characteristics snapped into place for me.


Hi Brenda - I guess some have done so, except the progressions are more about her evolved inner self, whereas transits show the gestalt of the moment, which for her isn't going so well, due to inner limitations resulting from buying into a system that doesn't favor women to begin with unless they start acting like men. I would advise her completely differently than her inner circle, but then again, I'm merely an astrologer.;-)

Hi Jessica - Glad you found your real time and didn't just accept whatever random assumptions were out there. I also agree that her "breezy" attitude is a symptom of Gemini rising, while the underlying intensity of Sun in Scorpio drives her boat, packaged in the Piscean mutability of feeling how to move whichever way the wind blows. She needs more starch in her spine, more genuineness and less aggressiveness and slick maneuvering that her husband is legendary for but which has backfired as the public atmosphere has changed these past 15 years. I like Bill, but he IS a political animal and therefore as instinctive as a lizard.


Hi Robert.

I quote you:
"The unpredictable factor in the chart is her retrograde Uranus in Gemini. This makes her a forerunner of the future, and harbinger of change, here to free herself and others from obsolete security anchors. Very few will ever get close to this extraordinarily complex woman, as she wants a little distance between herself and others".

In which ways can we read differently this Gemini Uranus function if is in natal direct motion or, as it is the case, if is in a retrograde one?. I can figure out that the "distance" of Hillary is a Gemini generational/transpersonal trait (talking about Uranus), not a personal trait by itself.

Anyway, I hardly can oversee a more clever -perhaps in high risk of truth distorion- combination than that between the Fixed Scorpio Water intensity -deep emotional perceptions/fixations for good or ill- and the Mutable Gemini Air that expands that inner water storm with eagerness and emotionally-detached aims.

Really,, a Scorpio ASC Gemini could be Mata-Hari...ha ha!!.

Blessings dear net-family.


Hi Henry - The differences in how a RX vs direct outer planet works could fill a book. And yes, the intensity of Scorpio moving in several different directions all at once could yield hectic manifestations. I'm sure right now she's like a chameleon on a Scotch plaid that cannot figure out what pattern to show, since all of them are leaving her burned.

Hassan Jaffer

Hi everyone,

I just came across this section and wanted to make some comments about Hillary's Asc whcih nobody seems to have addressed. In fact, I ahve not even updated my own website yet but will rigth after writing here!

Hillary Clinton in my opinion is about 27 deg Taurus rising! Eventhing fits it seems. Thsi woudl give her a little bit of Taurus and mostly Gemini in the first. She is definitely not fickle in anything like a Gem rising. She has that Taurus stocky figure and is beginning to show the glandular features her throat.

Give the reasoning why you jsutify an Asc not just an opinion based on the personlaity.
1- When she met Bill Clinton, her future husband, Jupiter was in Sag in her 7th (he was studying law like here!).

2- When Chelsea was born, Saturn was in her 5th (restrictions due to children) and Jupiter was also transiting her 5th (lucky for having children).
3- In 2008 she raised more millions than in anytime in her life, guess where Jupiter was transiting? In her 8th of course!
Moon in Pisces in her 11th is the volunteer work etc that she is involved in (almost similar to Neptune in 11th with Scoripio rising).

5- Elected a senator when Satrun touched her 1st house (new responsibilities).

Saturn is starting to rise in her chart and Jupiter wil lbe on top in the 10th in 2009, indicating she is on her way to being involved with a lot of charities and issues pertaining to the welfare of the people but not a VP as Saturn is still below the 7th (in her 5th in fact).

What accounts for Mars Saturn and Pluto in 4th? Fights at home and arguments even when she was in the Whitehouse. Her fame was not for herself but when was at the WH entertaining heads of diferent countries. Saturn is not in her 3rd but a Saturn sq Mercury will also make her left handed, which she is.

When she foudn about her husband's tryst, Moon was in Aries going into taurus in her 12th house.

Her open enemy would be her 7th house (Scorpio on 7th) which makes sense even though Bill Clinton helped her a lot, it was because of him and his enemies like that stupid Kenn Starr who wasted $40 million) that brought her a lto of humiliation.

Bil Clinton has Aries and Taurus his 7th, and her personality will have the Taurus shown in his chart. Taurus rising is also one of the most dependable signs along with her Venus in Scorpio (in terms of her marriage).

You are welcome to comment or write your emails to me withyoru astro reasoning, not just I think she has this asc or that. Regards

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